What to do when you DD isn't getting the position she moved teams for

mad-baller wrote:All this feedback is FANTASTIC - thank you.
She does "just need to play" - and the coach does know what he is doing.
Working on a team where ever girl is digging in and always on their toes is a much better environment.
So, I guess we'll continue to try this for a while and I'm just going to need her to get in her head she's got to earn a front-spot and learn another part of the field in the interim.
I do think the coach lied to me, but I'll just have to accept that part of it.

If your DD really loves this new team and she really loves playing fullback, then I think this is definitely the correct course of action. If she doesn’t though, by sticking this out, you’re potentially making a big mistake. Above all things soccer should be fun, particularly for younger children with their more delicate psyches. If this situation isn’t fun for her as things are, you need to move her.

Some of us think that our DD’s love for soccer is infinite but that’s never the case. All of us, even kids, have limits.

You better know, with a crystal clear understanding, that your DD is thrilled with her current situation. If you don’t, and you let soccer stop being fun for her because you wanted your DD on a “legendary team”, she’ll be burned out in months. The signs will be subtle at first so you better be paying close attention.

If she decides she wants to stop playing and leave the game entirely, it won’t matter which legendary academy team she USED TO play with. All that will matter is that she’s a girl that USED TO play soccer but doesn't anymore.

This is somewhat related, maybe a little different but I absolutely regret not having my dd play multiple positions through academy and beginning select. She is a GK and has played at D1 level for several years. She enjoys it but is totally stuck in that position. Even with good skills, she can't even come close to playing at the level of her teammates. I have seriously considered finding a d3 team that would give her the opportunity to do both, if she'd even be able to play the field at that level. Ego somewhat involved there...we always liked that she played at the top level instead of considering what it was doing to her as a total player. We are almost at a point now that is will be too late for her to have a opportunity try to get some field experience if she is wanting to play college level.

So I'd say definitely let her get experience in all positions at this age, you really have no idea what the next few years will bring...things change...her size and speed will also be affected by how her body continues to develop and how puberty affects her.

If you think the coach lied to you, you need to rectify that. I would suggest scheduling a time to talk with the coach and present him your version of the facts, and see what he has to say about that. If you are not completely satisfied with his answer, you need to find a coach you can TRUST. It may be that you interpreted something he said in a way that he did not mean it.

For me, you can't get over "the coach lied to me". If that's the case, there's no relationship.

If he lies to you, will he lie to other parents?

If he lies to you, will he lie to your daughter?

Get to the bottom. I'm just saying.

Question to any of you "elders" out there -

What % of the top forwards at U-9 / U10 do you think maintain their stature by U-15?
Why? Emotional burn-out, talent-tops out?

As a newbie, I'd always presumed that top young teams just keep-on and deliver the ENCL kids down the road. (I already hear the LOLs from many of you....) But seriously, clue me in on keeping my good thing going. I hear about "development development" but ponder if that is just like a health club sales person selling a Soccer Mom on "toning and conditioning" (meaning just taking their money and telling them "it will come - be patient.")

Thanks.

My dd's U18 defense is made up of 2 former forwards, a mid and 1 that has played d since U11. All of them were original players on our U11 team. Of the original forwards, only one still plays forward. All of them will receive scholarship money from D1 programs.

As for your question of which forwards are still studs, most are, just not always at that position.

I don't have any hard numbers but a lot of these kids are going to flame out before it matters. Heck look at all these kids that play in the Little League World Series, by the time they reach HS they are so tired of playing baseball and the stress of always needing to be on top that they switch sports. It happens in soccer too. I really wouldn't worry about being on the top team at U-10 or U-9, yes you want to be on a competitive team and not some rec bunch ball team but I can promise over the last two weeks not once did I hear anyone on the Olympic telecast talk about how Alex Morgan's team when she was 10 was the Top team in California.

Just find a place where she enjoys playing, don't worry about the other stuff right now. It's coming soon enough.

I sent you a pm too mad-baller.

I suppose if the team is legendary they already have some very talented forwards. If my daughter was switching to this team I would not expect her to displace another girl immediately no matter how great she is. If she is all that she will get her chance and needs to prove herself on the new team. We switched for this season to a top team and I never expected my DD to play 100% of the time. I told her she needed to work even harder to prove herself to the coach and the team. Last thing you want to do is pizz off the whole team and annoy the heck out of the coach.

If you trust the coach you need to trust him/her to put your kid in the right place. My son (U11) has been with a coach we like and respect for 2 years. BB is a left footed midfielder with pretty good ball handling skills; he makes a difference on the field. Last season he was suddenly in the back, played fb and sweeper most of the season and several other players were shifted around as well. We were upset, he's a midfielder not a defender. Fast forward to now - he is far more confident on the field in general, he knows what to expect from the mids when he plays defense and vice versa. It's changed the style of the team quite a bit - they know they have a skilled defender and they use him, lots of dropping the ball to maintain possession. He's turning into a utility player, coach can put him just about anywhere on the field and he'll perform - all because coach took him out of his comfort zone to try something new. We trusted the coach to do what was right for the players and team and it worked out well.

Of course if you don't trust the coach you probably shouldn't be on the team.

http://www.ussoccer.com/teams/wnt/o/kelley-ohara.aspx

Help her learn to be a soccer "player" rather a position. Skills translate all over the field, as many have already stated.

This is a link to the bio of Kelly O'Hara. Played forward all her life and had huge success. Came to the USWNT and they asked her to play left back. Just won a Gold Medal and played the whole tournament. If a player like her can be asked to move positions, so can your kid. Tell her to read this story, then go out and buy her a #5 USWNT jersey and tell her to be Kelly O'Hara.

Being on the field (at any position) is better than a back-up anything. She needs to play.

FanofSoccer wrote:http://www.ussoccer.com/teams/wnt/o/kelley-ohara.aspx

Help her learn to be a soccer "player" rather a position. Skills translate all over the field, as many have already stated.

This is a link to the bio of Kelly O'Hara. Played forward all her life and had huge success. Came to the USWNT and they asked her to play left back. Just won a Gold Medal and played the whole tournament. If a player like her can be asked to move positions, so can your kid. Tell her to read this story, then go out and buy her a #5 USWNT jersey and tell her to be Kelly O'Hara.

Being on the field (at any position) is better than a back-up anything. She needs to play.

Winning!

bigtex75081 wrote:

mad-baller wrote:All this feedback is FANTASTIC - thank you.
She does "just need to play" - and the coach does know what he is doing.
Working on a team where ever girl is digging in and always on their toes is a much better environment.
So, I guess we'll continue to try this for a while and I'm just going to need her to get in her head she's got to earn a front-spot and learn another part of the field in the interim.
I do think the coach lied to me, but I'll just have to accept that part of it.

If your DD really loves this new team and she really loves playing fullback, then I think this is definitely the correct course of action. If she doesn’t though, by sticking this out, you’re potentially making a big mistake. Above all things soccer should be fun, particularly for younger children with their more delicate psyches. If this situation isn’t fun for her as things are, you need to move her.

Some of us think that our DD’s love for soccer is infinite but that’s never the case. All of us, even kids, have limits.

You better know, with a crystal clear understanding, that your DD is thrilled with her current situation. If you don’t, and you let soccer stop being fun for her because you wanted your DD on a “legendary team”, she’ll be burned out in months. The signs will be subtle at first so you better be paying close attention.

If she decides she wants to stop playing and leave the game entirely, it won’t matter which legendary academy team she USED TO play with. All that will matter is that she’s a girl that USED TO play soccer but doesn't anymore.

Reminds me of a favorite quote:

"When you stop doing things for fun you might as well be dead."- ERNEST HEMINGWAY
Rings true, especially for our DD's & BB. If they aren't having fun, there isn't any passion or drive. Then it just sucks (to play AND for us to watch).

And, just for the record, the only "legendary" pre-select team is the GOS-the Girls of Steel, who are now entering their last year of select soccer (U-18). The greatest pre-select team in North Texas history, without question.

stillyuk wrote:And, just for the record, the only "legendary" pre-select team is the GOS-the Girls of Steel, who are now entering their last year of select soccer (U-18). The greatest pre-select team in North Texas history, without question.

North Texas? THE WORLD!

I am sure that you both believe your respective teams are legends in their own time but the reality is that they are legends in your own mind.

The last eight + years have shown me a few things....

The most physically talented players--the fastest and the strongest--are easy to identify early. A couple of them reach the top of the pile later in academy or very early in select, but they were strong and fast in academy. The most physically talented players usually start as forwards because that's where they can have the biggest impact on the game. As these players find their way into just a few teams (Sting and Texans ECNL across age groups plus a few age-group-specfic teams), they don't all play forward. The more creative, skillful players become midfielders; the players with a strong leg and maybe less skill migrate to defense. On defense, girls with more size play central while those with more speed play outside. The most physically talented players tend to stay that way all the way through high school, but I would point out that some of those girls work hard on their skills while others are satisfied to dominate physically. The girls who invest in skills and really enjoy playing the game end up as the top players.

My daughter took a different path. She started as an outside defender on the #2 team in the age group straight out of rec soccer. She was fast and strong (not the fastest or the strongest), but other girls were more skilled. When that team blew up, she moved to a team that wasn't as good but she played center mid because of the skills she had developed since starting in academy (thanks to her first coach!). After a few years playing in the center of the pitch for a good but not great team, she moved back to top team. She has been an attacking mid and forward since, mainly because she is poised in front of goal and those years in the middle of the pitch helped her read the game.

My main takeaways are that (1) speed and strength are gifts that keep on giving, (2) but the physically talented girls who improve their skills (because of good coaching and outside training) and really enjoy playing are the ones who end up playing wherever they want.

twotouch wrote:The last eight + years have shown me a few things....

The most physically talented players--the fastest and the strongest--are easy to identify early. A couple of them reach the top of the pile late in academy or very early in select, but they were strong and fast in academy. The most physically talented players usually start as forwards because that's where they can have the biggest impact on the game. As these players find their way into just a few teams (Sting and Texans ECNL across age groups plus a few age-group-specfic teams), they don't all play forward. The more creative, skillful players become midfielders; the players with a strong leg and maybe less skill migrate to defense. On defense, girls with more size play central while those with more speed play outside. The most physically talented players tend to stay that way all the way through high school, but I would point out that some of those girls work hard on their skills while others are satisfied to dominate physically. The girls who invest in skills and really enjoy playing the game end up as the top players.

My daughter took a different path. She started as an outside defender on the #2 team in the age group straight out of rec soccer. She was very fast and strong, but other girls were more skilled. When that team blew up, she moved to a team that wasn't as good but she was played center mid because of the skills she had developed since starting in academy (thanks to her first coach!). After a few years playing in the center of the pitch for a good but not great team, she moved back to top team. She has been an attacking mid and forward since, mainly because (in addition to speed and strength) she is poised in front of goal and those years in the middle of the pitch helped her read the game.

My main takeaways are that (1) speed and strength are gifts that keep on giving, (2) but the physically talented girls who improve their skills (because of good coaching and outside training) and really enjoy playing are the ones who end up on top.

This.

Last edited by twotouch on Tue Aug 14, 2012 6:43 pm; edited 5 times in total (Reason for editing : Sounded like I was bragging).

This has got to be a first on this forum:) Awesome!

I can say I have seen many of players that were "super stars" at U7/U8 that are now just middle of the road players. What happened? Everyone caught up and it became a more even playing field as the girls grew and developed. Some peaked early and some took longer to learn the game.

So while your dd may be a "super star" now doesn't necessarily mean she will be when it really counts. I wouldn't care about "legendary" team that just makes you seem like you have a big ego. What you need is for your dd to be on a competitive team where she is contributing and learning. You want a coach that is going to help develop her for the long run.

Let's be honest who cares if your dd is on a legendary team in academy. That is just bragging rights to your buddies to make you feel better. What matters is where she is at U15 and up. I have seen these "legendary" teams burn young players out at an early age. Will you or your dd remember beating another U8/U9 team? Or will you both remember a state cup or high school championship win? A college recruiter doesn't care she is on a "legendary" team at the academy level. There is no resume at this point.

My point is don't worry just about winning. A good player needs to learn to loss too. You need to do what is best for you dd and not what will make you look good to your buddies.

[quote="Gunners"]

twotouch wrote:The last eight + years have shown me a few things....

The most physically talented players--the fastest and the strongest--are easy to identify early. A couple of them reach the top of the pile late in academy or very early in select, but they were strong and fast in academy. The most physically talented players usually start as forwards because that's where they can have the biggest impact on the game. As these players find their way into just a few teams (Sting and Texans ECNL across age groups plus a few age-group-specfic teams), they don't all play forward. The more creative, skillful players become midfielders; the players with a strong leg and maybe less skill migrate to defense. On defense, girls with more size play central while those with more speed play outside. The most physically talented players tend to stay that way all the way through high school, but I would point out that some of those girls work hard on their skills while others are satisfied to dominate physically. The girls who invest in skills and really enjoy playing the game end up as the top players.

My daughter took a different path. She started as an outside defender on the #2 team in the age group straight out of rec soccer. She was very fast and strong, but other girls were more skilled. When that team blew up, she moved to a team that wasn't as good but she was played center mid because of the skills she had developed since starting in academy (thanks to her first coach!). After a few years playing in the center of the pitch for a good but not great team, she moved back to top team. She has been an attacking mid and forward since, mainly because (in addition to speed and strength) she is poised in front of goal and those years in the middle of the pitch helped her read the game.

My main takeaways are that (1) speed and strength are gifts that keep on giving, (2) but the physically talented girls who improve their skills (because of good coaching and outside training) and really enjoy playing are the ones who end up on top.

This is simply the best explanation of early dominance and progression! A sincere thank you for taking the time to write it. It is a big help and hopefully some other "newbies" can learn from it too. Thanks

Wow - so, I posted a simple question 24 hours ago and had about 2,900 views and 30 or so comments - all of which were very worthwhile and MUCH appreciated. Thank you again to everyone who offered their insight. This forum is simply a wonderful resource. Best!

Also from a parents perspective. Usually the issue of dealing with a new environment is the adjustments the parents needs to make, not so much the player. On your DD previous team your DD was the most "Skilled" player, and really stood out. Now you make the decision based on her playing ability to put her on a team with more players just like her. It's tough for us as parents, in the beginning, and let the coach explore other oportunities for your child, and us sit back and watch "Little Suzy" not score any more, when in fact the coach may see other abilities your child has to offer to the team, which her previous coach never noticed.

Here is a fun Fact:
Hope Solo didn't always play in the box. She was a two-time Parade All American at Richland High School. It wasn't until she went to Washington that she was moved to the goalkeeper position. Solo scored 109 goals in high school, taking her team to the state championship in her senior season.

In my experience it seems that many coaches will recruit based on the players abilities, not on a predisposed position. My daughter has primarily been in the same position ever since she started playing, which I have always thought of her in a different position or would have liked to see her at least explore such. However, we have been with several different teams and had many different coaches and they always put her up top and I have to assume they know more than I, especially since the combined placement is the same.