How big is the difference between D1 and D2?

Ok, in this age group, how much difference in skill and ability is there between D1 and D2?

Generally speaking, the bottom 3rd of any division is very close to the top 3rd of the next lower division. This holds true for D1/D2, D2/D3 and D3/Plano and maybe top 2 in Arlington. It also seems to hold true in Plano D1/D2 and D2/D3. Tournament games involving those teams are usually very close.

Last year I believe there was not much difference between the top half of D2 and most of D1. I also believe there were several D3 teams that athletically were on par with the top of D2.

Things could be very different going into U15 as many are going into High school and it's time to get serious. I believe the top players that did not move up previously (friends, location, etc) will be migrating to D1 or ECNL this summer. It should be interesting.

We have visited several D1 practices in the last two weeks and it seems that a lot of top players from D2 teams are already doing the same.

I thought the top of D2 and the D1 teams were pretty similar and the games tight. I specifically saw the sting teams flanny, royal, Garrett, Parker, and I feel that any one can beat another on a given day and with given ref. I thought pulp was a little better than the rest of d1, and andro is a good team. Bussey is good and fcd east is solid. I watched solar gold this year go 5 and 3 against the ones they played and only 3 games were as many as 2 goals difference. I feel that the top of D3 would be in a fight w those teams too. Injuries play a big part of those games. The talent, speed, and skill are relatively equal. Styles are different in some ways, but all seem pretty well coached and fun to watch.

The older the girls get, the smaller gap becomes. Players start quitting, divisions in LH have fewer teams, and so on. The more committed players to the sport tend to stick around creating a more competitive balance in the long run.

So......FCD East to Solar? Whole team? Most? Some?

backofthenet wrote:The older the girls get, the smaller gap becomes. Players start quitting, divisions in LH have fewer teams, and so on. The more committed players to the sport tend to stick around creating a more competitive balance in the long run.

So......FCD East to Solar? Whole team? Most? Some?

Yes... Now tell 'em the 2nd half of the rumor....

I don't know "the other half". Just have heard coach is taking kids to Solar to play D1.

I am thinking that the rumor is that pulp and missimo combine and that will leave solar with a club slot in D1.

I am not sure this is going to happen, but I have heard that rumor.

I can also see where Solar may think to entice a good team (FCDE) to come to Solar w that carrot, but that would be a bit of a slap to SG which beat them twice in league play (5-1 aggregate), and finished ahead of them in the standings.

FCDE had a terrific spring, and they have talent, but I think it would be wrong to place them above SG...

From the looks of things it seems Solar is hiring the coach, not just bringing over a team. I think a few FCDE players will follow to join with Solar players that are already there, plus new players that are coming out. I don't think FCDE will be taking over the bye. If the practices are any indication, it should be a strong team next year.

Madskills wrote:From the looks of things it seems Solar is hiring the coach, not just bringing over a team. I think a few FCDE players will follow to join with Solar players that are already there,  plus new players that are coming out. I don't think FCDE will be taking over the bye. If the practices are any indication, it should be a strong team next year.

You are clearly closer to it than I am. I appreciate your input. And that mix could certainly produce a very solid team. So by that estimation, will it be solar pulp and missimo in d1 then gold and east in d2?

Madskills wrote:From the looks of things it seems Solar is hiring the coach, not just bringing over a team. I think a few FCDE players will follow to join with Solar players that are already there,  plus new players that are coming out. I don't think FCDE will be taking over the bye. If the practices are any indication, it should be a strong team next year.

So is JH's move to Solar confirmed or just a rumor? This opens up some interesting possibilities on multiple fronts as he would be leaving his #2 '03 team as well as an up and coming '00 team back at FCD. Is JH jumping ship or being pushed?

If I were managing the Solar Club (not that it could ever happen) I would not endanger my relationship with a team (Solar Gold) that has proven itself as a top contender in D2 to move up another team to D1 just to get the team/coach in the door. That is how you start a team thinking that perhaps there is a better place for your team at another club who will treat you with more respect. You can offer other incentives to a club/coach to move over. If it were me, I would promote Solar Gold up to D1, move FCD to Solar and then promote another Solar team up to D2 to fill Solar Gold's slot. Just my opinion.

outonthelimb wrote:
 So is JH's move to Solar confirmed or just a rumor?  This opens up some interesting possibilities on multiple fronts as he would be leaving his #2 '03 team as well as an up and coming '00 team back at FCD.  Is JH jumping ship or being pushed?  

Who said he's leaving the '03's?   

Just to be on record...all of this is rumor to me. I haven't talked to any decision maker in this scenario.

It is an interesting conversation, but there are rumors all the time. I am not going to get twisted until there is any reason to be upset.

I agree that this COULD play out in a frustrating way, but it could also be a blessing that works out well for all parties. Time will tell.

I think everyone is working around the subject.

FCDE coach is moving to Solar as I understand the situation. My guess is he'll take those that want to go from the '00s and it will flesh out to see who makes the team.

Here's my scenario: Pulp loses some to ECNL more full time, Missimo bumps to Pulp to help coach the top group and brings a few with, JH steps over to take the old Missimo group and brings some FC players with. He's not gonna give up his '03s, so do the math there.

That's my story and I'm maybe sticking to it   

So it sounds like JH is dumping his team and taking his kid to Solar.

The last time JH cannibalized a team, he took his top players to D1, was relegated to D2, and is still in D2

This possible scenario and how it plays out brings up an issue that many, especially those of us who are new to the "game", have a problem with as it respects LHGCL and the structure and politics involved. If the above scenario happens, is it fair that a club should get to maintain a slot vacated by a team switching clubs, etc.? If you can't keep the team within the club, do you even deserve to keep the slot? Also, in one of the hypotheticals above, would there even be a Solar team deserving of the D2 slot that would be vacated? It should be about rewarding teams based on merit not politics. I know that sounds naive, but it's about the integrity of the game. How can a league as prestigious as LHGCL allow teams to remain in, or be elevated into, a slot that they are undeserving of as demonstrated by their performance on the field? I am sure there may be other factors involved that I am unaware of, but it doesn't appear to me to be about fairness and quality of play.

all I have to say is John is a scumbag

Knk, knk, knk, I would say that the Silver team shows great promise and would be at least able to make some headway if they were slotted. I think if Solar Gold is a good example of the coach's prowess then they should have some quality.

Assuming all of this happens wouldn't the bye stay with FCD?

It would seem to...which would FCD West Gold be next in line? If so, they better start writing their apology letters!   

Too bad the Cowboys can't get into the Super Bowl based on Staubach's and Aikman's reputations and achievements. Unfortunately, Jerry and company will have to earn their way. Maybe the Cowboys should try LHGCL.

Pale Rider wrote:Too bad the Cowboys can't get into the Super Bowl based on Staubach's and Aikman's reputations and achievements.  Unfortunately, Jerry and company will have to earn their way. Maybe the Cowboys should try LHGCL.

First, I doubt that the Cowboys could compete with the physicality of LHGCL.

Second, after thinking about it, I agree that it would be FCD's bye.

Third, you make a good point on reputation vs. achievement as far as Solar or another FCD team, but I can't see denying an FCD team the bye when that was theirs (even if the coach leaves). I don't know what to say except that it is the world we live in. There are several of LH's rules that advantage clubs with multiple teams. I said it last year when DTFW came into D2 and in CPP discussions...I think that if the club keeps the bye, and the team is coming from (at least) a division lower, I would advocate that LH drop the team into a lower (or the lowest) division and shameless self promotion teams with the track record up to fill the spots. DTFW was announced as the replacement for DT Red too late to be able to recruit for a "D2 team"...had their open spots been available to girls who were looking for that level rather than a team that will fight at QT, they might have had a few other girls sign with them...the same it true this year for FCD. If they know NOW that they are looking to fill a D2 roster, it makes it more attractive for players from D3 or PPL teams who want to step into that role, than it does to recruit for a chance at the QT...and I agree that it is most likely FCD's bye...and in my mind a coach leaving without taking the team should NOT affect the bye status for that group of girls...(maybe it should be N+1 or something to maintain the level??)

Third, I don't know how this move would make sense for his 03s...That team will be coming into Solar as the clear #2 whereas staying at FCD (OR at ANY other ECNL club) would put them AT LEAST in the argument as the top team...just not over SRSA.

InaB wrote:Knk, knk, knk, I would say that the Silver team shows great promise and would be at least able to make some headway if they were slotted. I think if Solar Gold is a good example of the coach's prowess then they should have some quality.

Ina, Ina, Ina, no disrespect to you, I heard you are a very nice old lady and I say that with all due respect because I too am AARP eligible, but some of the stuff you say... No doubt the Silver team has great promise and no doubt they have some quality due to the coaches prowess, but they aren't Solar Gold are they? Should gaining a slot be based on proven performance or just being able to "make some headway" if slotted? That could be said for any number of teams. They haven't earned that slot which is my whole point. Do you have so much club bias that it blinds your sense of fairness? Unlike some teams which shall remain nameless, my DD's team earned their way into LH. After failing to make it in the previous two yrs., despite being obviously able to compete/win at that level, they finally played their way in last summer. I say that only to make this next point. Now that we are in, what is the chance that we will even make it up to D1 (despite being good enough to compete at that level right now) by the time these girls graduate from HS? I know what has to happen on the playing field, which is difficult enough, but with the present system of promotion/relegation, club byes, etc., not to mention the internal self-destruction from players leaving to go play at the highest level possible because they are being unfairly held back from doing so with their current team/club, it will be tough odds. Competition on the playing field should be the only thing that stands in the way.