Plano labor day

WOW, seems that coaching is turning into teaching kids how to kick as hard as they can, just run after the ball and hit as many of the other team as possible. I watched a ton of soccer the weekend and am sad to say long ball is dominate in this age group. Yikes!!!!! Also an 06 team won gold and all 06 teams play on up made solid showings. Is our group falling victim to long ball coaching???

I've also noticed this trend in some college level teams. TCU vs. Missouri women's game was on tv this past weekend, so I watched to see how college level looks right now. Both teams have some nicely skilled players (Mizzou also very physically aggressive - lots of fouls), but they definitely employed the long-ball tactics a lot more than I would expect. Sometimes, if it's there and will help you score goals, fine. But, to be one-dimensional with that approach seems very limiting and is definitely shortsighted when it comes to developing younger players. TCU ended up winning with a PK in double overtime due to a foul in the box. Ref had let another one go earlier in OT, but the physical play finally caught up to MU, which I was glad for (disclosure: I am not an alum of either school).

The Power 5 conference coaches are between a rock and a hard place. Most would love to keep the ball and knock it around. But they have to recruit a certain level of athlete to even stay on the field with teams in their conference. And we're still not producing enough of those athletes who are technical, savvy players.

If they don't win, they're out of a job.

The good news is I think the trend is actually in the other direction. The next generation coming up is well ahead of the last one technically and some of these traditionally direct programs are getting commits from really good soccer players.

It won't change overnight. Supply and demand still rules.

Question.. I get some of the D1 schools do what they need to do in order to win and sometimes long ball supports that strategy. I have even seen it from NC, TAMU, and UT in recent matches (UT more than all due to the make up of the their team this year). My question... Are the smaller D2/D3 teams doing the same or are they actually focused on playing "proper soccer". Now everyone has heard my perspective on "long ball" or as some coaches will say "thru ball" and there is certainly a place for it in the game because you have to take what the opponent gives you, but anyone who saw PLD soccer this weekend, long ball was the strategy for many teams and not just in the '05 age group. It dominated many games in the '03s as well.

Please explain "long ball" and "proper soccer". I'm just trying to determine if "long ball" is when the defender just sends the ball down field for the forward to chase down or is it "long ball" if the defender passes to a midfielder, who passes to another midfielder, then that player sends a "thru ball" up the field for the forward? How many passes make it "proper soccer"? FTR, I'm not trying to be an ass. I really would like to know.

IAmSoccerfan wrote:Please explain "long ball" and "proper soccer".  I'm just trying to determine if "long ball" is when the defender just sends the ball down field for the forward to chase down or is it "long ball" if the defender passes to a midfielder, who passes to another midfielder, then that player sends a "thru ball" up the field for the forward?  How many passes make it "proper soccer"?  FTR, I'm not trying to be an ass.  I really would like to know.  

The long ball, thru ball and/or kickball is how the other team plays when your team loses.  Proper soccer is how your team plays win or lose.

Got it?

Back to the OP, the 05 gold division was a hodgepodge of good and bad teams. A smattering of 05 LH D1,d2, maybe a d3, 2 very good 06 teams (including DTS), and a very good team from Oklahoma. The quality of soccer played from game to game probably varied wildly. I don't think this tournament can be used to deduce anything other than the powers that be have spread talent across 4 different leagues which has watered down the overall playing field. You will continue to find quality and lack of within the same bracket going forward.

I don't know about the long ball comment. The games we were a part of had some decent soccer being played by kicks and Oklahoma. I imagine the two 06 teams offered the same. Beyond that you are dealing with D2/3 teams who may not have found their sea legs just yet.

Long Ball = Defender or Mid launching ball from their side of pitch with no regard to where it goes and hope the only girl with skills up top can collect the ball and out muscle the defender with size/leverage/pushing/fouling to get a shot or wait until the skilled player who plays outside mid/forward to catch up to receive the drop and then shoot from just outside the 18. If the "Long Ball" was made by the outside/center mid this is can be considered a thru ball as long as the ball doesn't rise above the logo on the player jersey where the receiving player can collect it and then go to goal. There might be some who disagree with this definition but you get the idea.

IAmSoccerfan wrote:Please explain "long ball" and "proper soccer".  I'm just trying to determine if "long ball" is when the defender just sends the ball down field for the forward to chase down or is it "long ball" if the defender passes to a midfielder, who passes to another midfielder, then that player sends a "thru ball" up the field for the forward?  How many passes make it "proper soccer"?  FTR, I'm not trying to be an ass.  I really would like to know.  

Nothing wrong with a nicely placed, nicely received long ball. But when you watch a team launch balls from the back that go over the touchline or end-line 80% of the time, you really need to wonder. But occasionally a blind hog finds an acorn and one is launched into the opposing box, bounces around for a minute and a half and is toe-poked in.

Then it's brilliant soccer.

TxFutbal wrote:Long Ball = Defender or Mid launching ball from their side of pitch with no regard to where it goes and hope the only girl with skills up top can collect the ball and out muscle the defender with size/leverage/pushing/fouling to get a shot or wait until the skilled player who plays outside mid/forward to catch up to receive the drop and then shoot from just outside the 18.  If the "Long Ball" was made by the outside/center mid this is can be considered a thru ball as long as the ball doesn't rise above the logo on the player jersey where the receiving player can collect it and then go to goal.  There might be some who disagree with this definition but you get the idea.

You have just described how Man U play with Lukaku in the lineup...........and they happen to be at the top of the EPL table, with 3 games in.

I always thought soccer is the game of using your strengths and maximizing your opponents weakness.  If you have speed and power as your strength, why would you want to walk the ball from your end to the other?  If you have Wambach as your striker, why would you want lo play low balls?  If you have Xavi, Messi and Iniesta, why would you want to play long balls past your mids?

If a team can put balls in the other side's net, that is the proper way to play the game.  Otherwise, it is a ballet on a soccer pitch.

soccerjack wrote:

IAmSoccerfan wrote:Please explain "long ball" and "proper soccer".  I'm just trying to determine if "long ball" is when the defender just sends the ball down field for the forward to chase down or is it "long ball" if the defender passes to a midfielder, who passes to another midfielder, then that player sends a "thru ball" up the field for the forward?  How many passes make it "proper soccer"?  FTR, I'm not trying to be an ass.  I really would like to know.  

The long ball, thru ball and/or kickball is how the other team plays when your team loses.  Proper soccer is how your team plays win or lose.

Got it?

Makes sense to me.

05girls wrote:Back to the OP, the 05 gold division was a hodgepodge of good and bad teams.  A smattering of 05 LH D1,d2, maybe a d3, 2 very good 06 teams (including DTS), and a very good team from Oklahoma.  The quality of soccer played from game to game probably varied wildly.  I don't think this tournament can be used to deduce anything other than the powers that be have spread talent across 4 different leagues which has watered down the overall playing field.  You will continue to find quality and lack of within the same bracket going forward.  

Very true but an even better way to put it is that the addition of ECNL and DA at U13 has decimated the field that still play PLD and at LHGCL for that matter ... both on a slippery slope towards mediocrity.  This will be the last either will see of DTS 06 as well.

Add JDL to that list.

in terms of talent and playing level:
ECNL replaced by DA
LHGCL D1/JDL/Champions League replaced by ECNL
PPL replaced by LHGCL D1/JDL/Champions League
what replaces PPL? Rec? then what replaces Rec?

nows a good time to be a ref for some extra bucks...theres plenty of soccer to go around.
Even City Futsal has outdoor teams now.
Not saying anything about a money grab at all....
But Lets get this money!!

All this change to stand back and realize "thangs are still the same"

JonSneauxTargaryen wrote:in terms of talent and playing level:
ECNL replaced by DA
LHGCL D1/JDL/Champions League replaced by ECNL
PPL replaced by LHGCL D1/JDL/Champions League
what replaces PPL? Rec? then what replaces Rec?

nows a good time to be a ref for some extra bucks...theres plenty of soccer to go around.
Even City Futsal has outdoor teams now.
Not saying anything about a money grab at all....
But Lets get this money!!

All this change to stand back and realize "thangs are still the same"

Its not what replaces Rec its what will replace DA.

KeeperCommander wrote:

JonSneauxTargaryen wrote:in terms of talent and playing level:
ECNL replaced by DA
LHGCL D1/JDL/Champions League replaced by ECNL
PPL replaced by LHGCL D1/JDL/Champions League
what replaces PPL? Rec? then what replaces Rec?

nows a good time to be a ref for some extra bucks...theres plenty of soccer to go around.
Even City Futsal has outdoor teams now.
Not saying anything about a money grab at all....
But Lets get this money!!

All this change to stand back and realize "thangs are still the same"

Its not what replaces Rec its what will replace DA.

Fun stuff KC -- What's your best guess?

And on a more personal note ... How long are you guys gonna hold out until you bring her over to try to win a spot?

10 years ago no one 00.1% thought ECNL was viable. Now in its 9th year and not slowing but it was thought that a better league was possible. Now they say it's DA. So how long before someone decides DA has run its course and invents a new better league? My guess, in 5 years DA will be revamped.

KeeperCommander wrote:10 years ago no one thought ECNL was viable. Now in its 9th year and not slowing but it was thought that a better league was possible. Now they say it's DA. So how long before someone decides DA has run its course and invents a new better league? My guess, in 5 years DA will be revamped.

Gotcha KC and fair assessment, although I think "no one" is a little strong --

I could be wrong here but wasn't the ECNL the pioneer when it came to creation of super teams at each of it's representing clubs that would showcase regionally and nationally?  In this case however, the USSDA isn't having to recreate the wheel.  And as unfair to US Club as it may be ... because the USSF is the supreme governing body over the highest levels of soccer in our country ... it isn't likely to matter.

I do know that outside of the Texans U13s and U14s, most of the top U13-U15 talent (and some of the top talent from the ECNL exclusive clubs) in Texas has gone to the DA teams.  I'd bet that this is the case at most of the DA clubs in the Frontier Division (and much of the country) as well.

We shall soon see.

BigErn wrote:

KeeperCommander wrote:10 years ago no one thought ECNL was viable. Now in its 9th year and not slowing but it was thought that a better league was possible. Now they say it's DA. So how long before someone decides DA has run its course and invents a new better league? My guess, in 5 years DA will be revamped.

Gotcha KC and fair assessment, although I think "no one" is a little strong --

I could be wrong here but wasn't the ECNL the pioneer when it came to creation of super teams at each of it's representing clubs that would showcase regionally and nationally?  In this case however, the USSDA isn't having to recreate the wheel.  And as unfair to US Club as it may be ... because the USSF is the supreme governing body over the highest levels of soccer in our country ... it isn't likely to matter.

I do know that outside of the Texans U13s and U14s, most of the top U13-U15 talent (and some of the top talent from the ECNL exclusive clubs) in Texas has gone to the DA teams.  I'd bet that this is the case at most of the DA clubs in the Frontier Division (and much of the country) as well.

We shall soon see.

Corrected to be more believable.

BigErn wrote:

KeeperCommander wrote:

JonSneauxTargaryen wrote:in terms of talent and playing level:
ECNL replaced by DA
LHGCL D1/JDL/Champions League replaced by ECNL
PPL replaced by LHGCL D1/JDL/Champions League
what replaces PPL? Rec? then what replaces Rec?

nows a good time to be a ref for some extra bucks...theres plenty of soccer to go around.
Even City Futsal has outdoor teams now.
Not saying anything about a money grab at all....
But Lets get this money!!

All this change to stand back and realize "thangs are still the same"

Its not what replaces Rec its what will replace DA.

And on a more personal note ... How long are you guys gonna hold out until you bring her over to try to win a spot?

Ah the dark side, yes very good question. First we must complete our training with Yoda and then we will see.

KeeperCommander wrote:

BigErn wrote:

KeeperCommander wrote:

JonSneauxTargaryen wrote:in terms of talent and playing level:
ECNL replaced by DA
LHGCL D1/JDL/Champions League replaced by ECNL
PPL replaced by LHGCL D1/JDL/Champions League
what replaces PPL? Rec? then what replaces Rec?

nows a good time to be a ref for some extra bucks...theres plenty of soccer to go around.
Even City Futsal has outdoor teams now.
Not saying anything about a money grab at all....
But Lets get this money!!

All this change to stand back and realize "thangs are still the same"

Its not what replaces Rec its what will replace DA.

And on a more personal note ... How long are you guys gonna hold out until you bring her over to try to win a spot?

Ah the dark side, yes very good question.  First we must complete our training with Yoda and then we will see.

Touche ... very clever KC.  There's always Solar ya know --  

And BTW ... many out there would consider LP and Coach AF the dark side

BigErn wrote:

KeeperCommander wrote:

BigErn wrote:

KeeperCommander wrote:

JonSneauxTargaryen wrote:in terms of talent and playing level:
ECNL replaced by DA
LHGCL D1/JDL/Champions League replaced by ECNL
PPL replaced by LHGCL D1/JDL/Champions League
what replaces PPL? Rec? then what replaces Rec?

nows a good time to be a ref for some extra bucks...theres plenty of soccer to go around.
Even City Futsal has outdoor teams now.
Not saying anything about a money grab at all....
But Lets get this money!!

All this change to stand back and realize "thangs are still the same"

Its not what replaces Rec its what will replace DA.

And on a more personal note ... How long are you guys gonna hold out until you bring her over to try to win a spot?

Ah the dark side, yes very good question.  First we must complete our training with Yoda and then we will see.

Touche ... very clever KC.  There's always Solar ya know --  

And BTW ... many out there would consider LP and Coach AF the dark side

So y'all know each other....

I like soccer