Re: Player Passing

by Eddyinmyyeti 28/04/19, 11:11 pm

Lol... again that is not what I am saying. FCD is not the only club that has pooled talent into an “A team”. And my point was actually that it is smart for the teams who haven’t pooled onto an”A team” to use other team’s players when needed because the talent is so spread out from team to team. I will agree to disagree with you on this. Enjoy your evening.

by BENDMEOVER 29/04/19, 06:20 am

With roster manipulation player pass is not even top of the reindeer list. It's only going to get worse the more leagues controlled by the masters of the games. Development is dead.

by Offsides 29/04/19, 07:11 am

The sad part is the parents follow blindly.. Your coach isnt developing your daughter by bringing in players. Your coach isnt doing anything for your team either and causing parents to get frustrated. So if your daughter is impacted by guest players at 09 level there is an issue and realize your daughter is on the bubble. It may be fine first year select they will keep an open spot for that Unicorn if it pips up but come year 2 beware.. Lots of movement and those on the bubble will get knocked off by parents mad their kids didnt make D1 have been relegated to D2 etc. Once you get further in well the best play the rest sit. So be realistic and see the signs early and dont believe everything most coachs tell you. Best of luck.

by Mpereztx10 29/04/19, 08:42 am

Just wanted to give my two cents, i can honestly say that Samba 09 does not help Salsa 09 in tough games. Samba is Samba and Salsa is Salsa. At some point there might have been a player or two in limbo going back and forth. I understand if you only have 10 committed players and you need borrow players. I think if you have a full roster lets say 12 or 13 players, there is no need to have anyone else. Again just my opinion, not saying its right or wrong. Every club and coach has a different vision. I think here lately there have been a lot of player sharing within clubs at all levels, not just the top 10 teams. Does this still happen a lot once you go to Classic League?

by Squadgoals 29/04/19, 08:44 am

Sometimes a player from a “B” team starts to step it up and gets moved up. Good job to that player for working hard to earn a spot and be able to start getting play time with the “A” team.

by soccerisdumb 29/04/19, 08:59 am

Offsides wrote:The sad part is the parents follow blindly.. Your coach isnt developing your daughter by bringing in players. Your coach isnt doing anything for your team either and causing parents to get frustrated. So if your daughter is impacted by guest players at 09 level there is an issue and realize your daughter is on the bubble. It may be fine first year select they will keep an open spot for that Unicorn if it pips up but come year 2 beware.. Lots of movement and those on the bubble will get knocked off by parents mad their kids didnt make D1 have been relegated to D2 etc. Once you get further in well the best play the rest sit. So be realistic and see the signs early and dont believe everything most coachs tell you. Best of luck.

Very well said. Couldn't agree more. It is all about winning; I don't care what the coach says. Winning is the coach's goal, not development. Its a shame really; the 9y olds deserve better and parents are brainwashed by these coaches. And its fine and dandy with these parents that think its ok to bring in guest players with a full roster until its there child thats affected and their kid is coming off the field because they didn't get to play at all in a game and the guests play the entire game. If that's not a red flag about the coach I don't know what is

by Offsides 29/04/19, 09:40 am

Also chasing doesnt get you any further usually. Your kid needs to a stand out to knock off the starters on a top team and just being better wont do it. Many of these girls have played together for years and they know their teamates and think as one. My daughters fellow defenders & goalie play together and communicate and have eachothers backs. You cant bring in a guest and if we have a player injured we have other teamates on our team that can take over with minimal impact even a backup goalie. If we need players due to multiple missing players we pull from the Salsa team. If you want to play on the Samba team you need to earn a spot. I have nothing but positive things to say about our Coach Skip Scarfone. I just want parents to be aware. I went through misery with my oldest and can see very clearly the 2nd time around. I am settling in committing to our Coach & Team so we can have the best group and develop together win or lose.. We do it as a team.

by KeepersBeCrazy 29/04/19, 09:42 am

I think girls going B -> A, or filling in for a sick or injured kid are fine.
What I wouldn't put up with as a parent is when the coach brings in girls to win tough games when the team roster is already full and nobody is sick/injured.

Little GirlNameA, I have good news and bad news. Your soccer skills are developing very nicely, and GirlNameB from our sister team is playing with us today so you'll get a bit less playing time. But the good news is that we're going to win this game! Aren't you excited and don't you want to keep playing soccer and getting better?! We'll play tougher and tougher teams, so don't expect a lot of playing time because GirlNameB is really good. But by training under me, I'll develop you to be better than her, so just keep paying your dues.

by melashbrew 29/04/19, 10:12 am

So many good points here. I understand borrowing a player or two if you are legit short of players and I also understand using a guest goalie if your goalie is injured and unable to play. Beyond that, I do not understand why players would stay on a team that brings in guests just to (hopefully) win. To me, that shows a complete lack of integrity and sends a message to the players on the team that the coach does not believe in them and winning is more important than the team. The funny thing is, the teams that are known for bringing in the guests don't need to. They are great teams. It just makes everyone doubt how good they really are though because you know you aren't strictly playing the players actually committed to the team.

Between my two, we have played mostly at big clubs. Thankfully their coaches have never done the whole guest player thing unless we had a need for numbers or there were kids trying out for the team. Opportunity is a big part of what we look for in a team...definitely would not go somewhere where the opportunity is unnecessarily stifled. I don't know many 9-10 year olds that would enjoy sitting the bench while players from other teams come in and play in their place.

by Offsides 29/04/19, 10:39 am

Exactly we are talking about 9 year olds that werent supposed to be dealing with all this BS other than LHCGL seeing $$$$$ they can make probably working on a Little Tikes LHCGL league to give byes into the Junior league for all you parents of 7 & 8 year olds. Yes soccer development in the USA is alive and well.

by Guest 29/04/19, 10:43 am

FWIW, a little bit of insight from an '01 parent about to be out the door.

We had these same discussions, and hashed and re-hashed all of these points about guest playing in U9/U10 academy when our '01's were that age 8 years ago. Pretty sure we were hashing and re-hashing the same points that the '94 parents were making about it when their kids where U9/U10.

We hashed and re-hashed all of these points when LH adopted CPP 5 years ago too.

The points are:

1) It's COMPETITIVE soccer. Nothing is guaranteed when it comes to PT.
2) Club soccer in NTX is a business. Pandora's Box was opened up on this 20+ years ago, and it ain't going away.

If you want to wail away at the system, go ahead, but IMO, you are just tilting at windmills. The better approach, again IMO, is to realize that it is what it is. Educate yourself and be objective about your kid so that you can place them in the best situation to avoid any heartache over guest playing or CPP.

Even with all of that, your kid and/or your team might get screwed over by CPP. My advice is the quicker you can get over it and figure out the best way to move forward, the better. One thing I can guarantee you is that coming on here to whine and complain might make you feel a little better for a few minutes, but it isn't going to help you sleep better at night, and it isn't going to fix a damn thing.

Then, 8 years from now, some of you will be typing this same message to the '17 parents complaining about their kids getting bumped for some guest players.

by NTXSoccaDad 29/04/19, 11:05 am

Are we talking about U10 player pass? No such thing....these girls are all academy and still free agents.

If you're concerned about a player from another team gobbling up your dd's minutes some very valid points have been made above and probably time to find a different team.

by BENDMEOVER 29/04/19, 11:08 am

Roster manipulation to me is where it becomes the issue. When you add delete and work the system on top of player pass. At this point most teams have some sort of system in place designed by the voters. When you change a team in order to win on top of CPP that's the real issue.

by melashbrew 29/04/19, 12:16 pm

Yes, we understand technically everyone is a free agent at this point. Roster manipulation is probably the more accurate way to refer to what is going on. For those with older players chiming in- the Lake Highland Junior Classic League offers D1 byes for 1st place finishers in each of the 3 divisions, so some seem to be going to extremes.

by NTXSoccaDad 29/04/19, 12:29 pm

melashbrew wrote:Yes, we understand technically everyone is a free agent at this point. Roster manipulation is probably the more accurate way to refer to what is going on. For those with older players chiming in- the Lake Highland Junior Classic League offers D1 byes for 1st place finishers in each of the 3 divisions, so some seem to be going to extremes.

Isn't that what academy is all about? Coaches and players taking their time to make sure they find the right fit BEFORE they sign a contract. If both aren't doing it, due diligence isn't being done. Players and parents want to know where they stand with a coach (playing time, positions, etc) and coaches want the roster with the deepest bench they can have.

by KeepersBeCrazy 29/04/19, 12:42 pm

NTXSoccaDad wrote:Isn't that what academy is all about? Coaches and players taking their time to make sure they find the right fit BEFORE they sign a contract. If both aren't doing it, due diligence isn't being done. Players and parents want to know where they stand with a coach (playing time, positions, etc) and coaches want the roster with the deepest bench they can have.

I think NTXSoccaDad is right, the point of academy is to find the right fit before signing a year long contract.
But I think what's happening is that within a club, coaches/teams are bringing in top girls from other teams within the club to play, especially in tougher games and with a bye on the line. These players being brought in have zero intentions of feeling out the team (due diligence) because they'll be signing with their own team. If I were the player's parent being brought in, I'd feel good that they want my kid to come out and play. On the flip side, it must suck to be the kid who gets pushed aside because she isn't as good as SusieFromTheOtherTeam.

by BENDMEOVER 29/04/19, 12:46 pm

The fun is just beginning. Welcome to NTX soccer. Very Happy

by Butfirstsoccer09 29/04/19, 12:48 pm

KeepersBeCrazy - nailed it.

by ArsenalTX14 29/04/19, 12:59 pm

Call me crazy here ... but if a Coach is essentially bringing in "mercenaries" to help secure a particular Spot (or) Bye ... maybe all that "Development Talk" you hear at signing day is just cannon-fodder for the Win Column and the Coach's Residual Income for the next season??? Smile

by KeepersBeCrazy 29/04/19, 01:31 pm

Yes! Mercenary is the perfect term for this.
No loyalties to nobody, just coming in for the kill then get paid (maybe ice cream on the drive home).

I have to start an elite squad comprised of girls from any club, but only the top 4 and call it the A-Team. We survive as soldiers of fortune for the sole purpose of steamrolling your rival.
Anyone want in on this?

by ArsenalTX14 29/04/19, 01:50 pm

KeepersBeCrazy wrote:Yes! Mercenary is the perfect term for this.
No loyalties to nobody, just coming in for the kill then get paid (maybe ice cream on the drive home).

I have to start an elite squad comprised of girls from any club, but only the top 4 and call it the A-Team. We survive as soldiers of fortune for the sole purpose of steamrolling your rival.
Anyone want in on this?

Seal Team 6+1(GK) Smile

by sprint 29/04/19, 02:00 pm

The main take away from all of this is if your player is not one of the top 5 players on the team, DO NOT sign with that team.

Find a place where your player is indispensable, be it D2, D3 or Plano if need be. The player pass rules won't bother you at all if your kid is in the top 5.

by NTXSoccaDad 29/04/19, 02:24 pm

sprint wrote:The main take away from all of this is if your player is not one of the top 5 players on the team, DO NOT sign with that team.

Find a place where your player is indispensable, be it D2, D3 or Plano if need be. The player pass rules won't bother you at all if your kid is in the top 5.

#Truth

by bigballer07 29/04/19, 02:31 pm

No No, the main take away from all this is some of you have way to much time on your hands....lol lol!

by Cerv1973 29/04/19, 03:01 pm

This is too funny. I could only pray that every team we played did this. In a world where we hope for the best development possible I would imagine that every team would welcome playing the best possible team they could.

Seriously, you can’t compete against top 10 teams until you compete against top 10 teams. So if one of those teams bring in two, three, five ringers then you have gained respect and recognition for your abilities. And if you command that kind of respect you will be playing in the D1 division whether it is from the auto qualifying league or good old fashioned hard work in July!

Our team is a small club that battles through every game giving it all we have. We are dedicated to one another and understand the commitment it takes to play against the best.

That being said, we have been playing top competition for a while now and you learn who plays for who and you develop love/hate relationships for kids and their parents alike. Through this process, you can clearly see who are guest players and who aren’t and guess what, it doesn’t go on as much as this board leads you to believe.

Love the game and stop trying to kill it because your vicarious life isn’t what you thought it would be. Try to enjoy the limited time in which you get to see your kid enjoy the game because at this rate they won’t be playing much longer with the negative attitudes that surround them.

by Checkpoint Charlie 29/04/19, 03:07 pm

Cerv1973 wrote:This is too funny. I could only pray that every team we played did this. In a world where we hope for the best development possible I would imagine that every team would welcome playing the best possible team they could.

Seriously, you can’t compete against top 10 teams until you compete against top 10 teams. So if one of those teams bring in two, three, five ringers then you have gained respect and recognition for your abilities. And if you command that kind of respect you will be playing in the D1 division whether it is from the auto qualifying league or good old fashioned hard work in July!

Our team is a small club that battles through every game giving it all we have. We are dedicated to one another and understand the commitment it takes to play against the best.

That being said, we have been playing top competition for a while now and you learn who plays for who and you develop love/hate relationships for kids and their parents alike. Through this process, you can clearly see who are guest players and who aren’t and guess what, it doesn’t go on as much as this board leads you to believe.

Love the game and stop trying to kill it because your vicarious life isn’t what you thought it would be. Try to enjoy the limited time in which you get to see your kid enjoy the game because at this rate they won’t be playing much longer with the negative attitudes that surround them.

#MAGA

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