Impressions of HS teams so far

Hi LS.....long time, no see. I though I recognized your dd at the game (but everyone was so bundled up I didn't see you...in fact, not sure that was my wife I was cuddling with). Nice goal by your dd on that free kick.

You guys have a skilled, well-disciplined team and should make some noise in your district and beyond. Best of luck!

Also, good luck to everyone heading to Georgetown this weekend. Hope the weather improves.

LoneStar wrote:Ok, my kid is a freshman.....I am amazed by the parents who say that highschool soccer is a joke and a waste. Maybe I should start a new thread on this. As a parent I understand the injury issue, but playing for your school and with friends....I just don't understand the hate

LS,

I, like you, have tried to understand the "hate" and so far have found a few common threads:

1. There is no question in anyone's (coaches, parents, players college programs) mind that the best soccer being played is being played at the club/ecnl level. If your dd has aspirations of playing beyond HS, club/ecnl should be the priority. With the disparity of seasons (private vs public) there is an extended period of time that the club/ecnl coaches are not able to field their entire team for practices and games. This impact can be significant.

2. "For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also." This comes into play because in order for your dd to look/be the best she can be, every other player on the roster needs to be at all the practices and games being the best they can be. It is a much shorter path to recognition to be a great player on a great team vs. a great player on a mediocre team. Whether or not parents verbalize it or not, they internalize that part of the "big check" they write every year for club/ecnl is for your dd to be at all practices and game to help their dd look/be the best that they can be.

3. The injury issue. My dd's HS Coach stated that she didn't like Freshmen on the Varsity Team. She went on to further explain that HS soccer is not club/ecnl soccer. The technical level of HS players is significantly lower than club/ecnl and thus tends to be more physical with 17/18 year old bodies crashing into 14/15 year old bodies being inherently injury prone. The club/encl coaches list this and time away at the top of their issues with HS soccer. I'm not sure that this issue isn't blown out of proportion. I know that injuries occur and that those injuries impact their teams but can't validate that this is as big of an issue in reality.

4. The fun factor. At least at the D1/ecnl level most of our dds have been looking forward to playing for their HS (as well as the HS programs chomping at the bit to get them) for a few reasons. One being the fun factor with greatly reduced stress and pressure. Another being the chance to play on the same team as their buddies that they haven't been on the same team for some time. Another being the chance to play with a different coach and hear a different voice. Another being the chance for a middle of the pack club/ecnl player to be a "superstar" on the HS team.

5. The Cool factor. Granted all things listed above, there is still nothing in the club/ecnl world that can touch the cool factor of walking down the hallway of your HS on game day with your letter jacket having people cheer you on all day, or hearing the home crowd cheering from the stadium under the big lights or hearing your name in the morning announcements in home room.

The topic keeps coming up in ecnl at least, of not allowing ecnl players to play HS soccer. This would be a huge blow to Girls HS Soccer and I wouldn't expect the HS Soccer Machine to go quietly into the night on this. It would also take another of the "fun" aspects out of the club/ecnl experience which we all know, when it stops being fun . . . dds want to stop doing it.

Here is a question for all those who think ECNL will end up like the boys academy—

So, since girls committed to schools their sophomore year of school if they are good DI prospects for college, how many of you will pay for ECNL for 2 extra years. I would think you would be ok playing on a DI Lake Highlands team and then letting your daughter play high school soccer. Most places they could be scholarship at the LHGCL DI team so dues would not be a factor.

This is my thinking in why I don’t think teams are in the same position for girls as they are for boys. Anyone think differently. Would make DI more competitive as well with the players who are not playing ECNL.

Just a thought

This cost of ECNL vs LHGCL has been addressed by others...but I'll reiterate that the cost of playing on an ECNL team is not appreciably different than that of a top level D1 team (at older age groups). The better D1 teams are still traveling and still showcasing their players in order to secure scholarships.

IMO, there is not a perceived value to step down the training and competition. Even if these girls commit as 10th graders, they need to stay sharp and well-trained in order to bring value at the college level. I would not expect any movement back to LH from ECNL players except those that aren't getting the playing time/exposure they'd hoped for.

Additionally, to my knowledge, there has been no move to disallow ECNL players from playing on their HS teams (not by ECNL, maybe an individual team/club takes this stance). In fact, regional scheduling was put in the hands of the ECNL clubs....so they have the ability to schedule regional play around the high school schedule.

I am not sure why ECNL instituted the U18 age group. There really is no purpose for it. There might be a few that haven't committed but the majority will have. I don't want to travel as much as we do now but I am not going to move my kid either. Not that she would allow it any way.

My dd plays high school soccer and will her senior year as well. She loves it. Her club or coach have never said she shouldn't.

FatherGoose wrote:

LoneStar wrote:Ok, my kid is a freshman.....I am amazed by the parents who say that highschool soccer is a joke and a waste. Maybe I should start a new thread on this. As a parent I understand the injury issue, but playing for your school and with friends....I just don't understand the hate

LS,

I, like you, have tried to understand the "hate" and so far have found a few common threads:

1. There is no question in anyone's (coaches, parents, players college programs) mind that the best soccer being played is being played at the club/ecnl level. If your dd has aspirations of playing beyond HS, club/ecnl should be the priority. With the disparity of seasons (private vs public) there is an extended period of time that the club/ecnl coaches are not able to field their entire team for practices and games. This impact can be significant.

2. "For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also." This comes into play because in order for your dd to look/be the best she can be, every other player on the roster needs to be at all the practices and games being the best they can be. It is a much shorter path to recognition to be a great player on a great team vs. a great player on a mediocre team. Whether or not parents verbalize it or not, they internalize that part of the "big check" they write every year for club/ecnl is for your dd to be at all practices and game to help their dd look/be the best that they can be.

3. The injury issue. My dd's HS Coach stated that she didn't like Freshmen on the Varsity Team. She went on to further explain that HS soccer is not club/ecnl soccer. The technical level of HS players is significantly lower than club/ecnl and thus tends to be more physical with 17/18 year old bodies crashing into 14/15 year old bodies being inherently injury prone. The club/encl coaches list this and time away at the top of their issues with HS soccer. I'm not sure that this issue isn't blown out of proportion. I know that injuries occur and that those injuries impact their teams but can't validate that this is as big of an issue in reality.

4. The fun factor. At least at the D1/ecnl level most of our dds have been looking forward to playing for their HS (as well as the HS programs chomping at the bit to get them) for a few reasons. One being the fun factor with greatly reduced stress and pressure. Another being the chance to play on the same team as their buddies that they haven't been on the same team for some time. Another being the chance to play with a different coach and hear a different voice. Another being the chance for a middle of the pack club/ecnl player to be a "superstar" on the HS team.

5. The Cool factor. Granted all things listed above, there is still nothing in the club/ecnl world that can touch the cool factor of walking down the hallway of your HS on game day with your letter jacket having people cheer you on all day, or hearing the home crowd cheering from the stadium under the big lights or hearing your name in the morning announcements in home room.

The topic keeps coming up in ecnl at least, of not allowing ecnl players to play HS soccer. This would be a huge blow to Girls HS Soccer and I wouldn't expect the HS Soccer Machine to go quietly into the night on this. It would also take another of the "fun" aspects out of the club/ecnl experience which we all know, when it stops being fun . . . dds want to stop doing it.

Great post, FG.

Having recently moved into the area, I was hoping we'd have gotten away from the Club vs. HS thing. My daughter (don't know what DD is so I'll avoid it) has played Div1 club soccer for years and at U17, it's a blessing she still has love for the game. Between school, boys, training and pressure that exceeds anything I ever endured at her age, there are many distractions and reason to quit and we're thrilled she's still playing.
She plays club because she's always aspired to be the best and play the best, but She WANTS to play HS for the pride of representing her school. You can't compare the two in the departments of pride and fraternity any more than you can compare them in level of play.
Any good coach of either Club or HS should recognize the merits of both. Aren't the dangers of HS, dangers in club as well. For me it's ALWAYS about the child and the game and for their ability to enjoy the it while they can. And while my daughter(s) enjoys it, I'll be there watching proudly for as long as it lasts because I'm going to miss it a great deal soon enough.
My vote's for both if so inclined, but its up to the kids and their parents, not the coaches.

ECNL will follow Us Soccer Academy and soon to be pre-academy/ ECNL Jr's and eliminate high school sports participatation! It is not a matter of will it happen but when?

totalsoccer wrote:ECNL will follow Us Soccer Academy and soon to be pre-academy/ ECNL Jr's and eliminate high school sports participatation! It is not a matter of will it happen but when?

With what as their reason? To prepare for a career in WPS?????

socrocks wrote:I've got mixed feelings about the single high school, split campus plan. For a land-locked city like Coppell (and to some degree Southlake), I can see the value...and appreciate not dividing a community.

But for high growth cities like Frisco, McKinney, Keller, Mansfield, etc....it's just not an option. And having a huge enrollment is really not fair to the rest of the schools in the class. Back in my day, for the most part, graduating classes in 4A (was no 5A) were about 600ish. For everyone but Plano....who was over 1000. Back then, Plano used to win everything. Why? B/c they had 2 schools worth of athletes to build a super team from. BTW, what is the enrollment at Allen? That place is monstrous.

Our FM high schools are already bulging and there are plans for additional campuses (9th/10th grade separate campuses). Not sure I see the advantage of that vs just adding another full 4 yr high school.

An answer to my own question....
Holy Crap! Some of these schools are huge. Maybe it is time for 6A.
Why are the Plano/Allen schools not dominating the high school sports scene?


DISTRICT 10-5A

Allen 5388

McKinney 2121

McKinney Boyd 2900

Plano 5315

Plano East 6016

Plano West 4945

enrollment #'s came from Dallas Morning news article: http://www.dallasnews.com/sports/high-schools/headlines/20120203-2012-14-d-fw-area-district-alignments-with-comments-enrollment-figures.ece

http://www.chron.com/sports/article/Coaching-school-notes-6A-will-have-to-wait-once-2082414.php#ixzz1TT62jOnW

http://www.texasfootball.com/highschool-news/view/5833

"I'm sorry. I don't do impressions. My training is in psychiatry."

socrocks wrote:

socrocks wrote:I've got mixed feelings about the single high school, split campus plan. For a land-locked city like Coppell (and to some degree Southlake), I can see the value...and appreciate not dividing a community.

But for high growth cities like Frisco, McKinney, Keller, Mansfield, etc....it's just not an option. And having a huge enrollment is really not fair to the rest of the schools in the class. Back in my day, for the most part, graduating classes in 4A (was no 5A) were about 600ish. For everyone but Plano....who was over 1000. Back then, Plano used to win everything. Why? B/c they had 2 schools worth of athletes to build a super team from. BTW, what is the enrollment at Allen? That place is monstrous.

Our FM high schools are already bulging and there are plans for additional campuses (9th/10th grade separate campuses). Not sure I see the advantage of that vs just adding another full 4 yr high school.

An answer to my own question....
Holy Crap! Some of these schools are huge. Maybe it is time for 6A.
Why are the Plano/Allen schools not dominating the high school sports scene?


DISTRICT 10-5A

Allen 5388

McKinney 2121

McKinney Boyd 2900

Plano 5315

Plano East 6016

Plano West 4945

enrollment #'s came from Dallas Morning news article: http://www.dallasnews.com/sports/high-schools/headlines/20120203-2012-14-d-fw-area-district-alignments-with-comments-enrollment-figures.ece

Per UIL's website, the top 4 enrollments in the state of Texas are:

Plano East - 6015.5
Allen - 5388
Plano - 5314.5
Plano West - 4944.5
Next in line is Galena Park North Shore at 4601

Question: how do you have a .5 student?

Must be really short....or just, half witted.

LonDrew wrote:

socrocks wrote:

socrocks wrote:I've got mixed feelings about the single high school, split campus plan. For a land-locked city like Coppell (and to some degree Southlake), I can see the value...and appreciate not dividing a community.

But for high growth cities like Frisco, McKinney, Keller, Mansfield, etc....it's just not an option. And having a huge enrollment is really not fair to the rest of the schools in the class. Back in my day, for the most part, graduating classes in 4A (was no 5A) were about 600ish. For everyone but Plano....who was over 1000. Back then, Plano used to win everything. Why? B/c they had 2 schools worth of athletes to build a super team from. BTW, what is the enrollment at Allen? That place is monstrous.

Our FM high schools are already bulging and there are plans for additional campuses (9th/10th grade separate campuses). Not sure I see the advantage of that vs just adding another full 4 yr high school.

An answer to my own question....
Holy Crap! Some of these schools are huge. Maybe it is time for 6A.
Why are the Plano/Allen schools not dominating the high school sports scene?


DISTRICT 10-5A

Allen 5388

McKinney 2121

McKinney Boyd 2900

Plano 5315

Plano East 6016

Plano West 4945

enrollment #'s came from Dallas Morning news article: http://www.dallasnews.com/sports/high-schools/headlines/20120203-2012-14-d-fw-area-district-alignments-with-comments-enrollment-figures.ece

Per UIL's website, the top 4 enrollments in the state of Texas are:

Plano East - 6015.5
Allen - 5388
Plano - 5314.5
Plano West - 4944.5
Next in line is Galena Park North Shore at 4601

Question: how do you have a .5 student?

Notice that all 4 are in 8-5A

Big game in Flower Mound tonight as FMHS takes on Marcus.

Was a bit worried about the level of play and the frustration factor, but I'm really looking forward to beginning district play.
So far it's been fun.
Best of luck on a healthy season for all the girls.

Frisco vs Ursuline. Last non district game for Frisco, should be fun

LoneStar wrote:Frisco vs Ursuline. Last non district game for Frisco, should be fun

I have Frisco playing Hockaday today. Is that incorrect?

locomotion wrote:

LoneStar wrote:Frisco vs Ursuline. Last non district game for Frisco, should be fun

I have Frisco playing Hockaday today. Is that incorrect?

My bad, you are correct

Plano West 2 Marcus 1