05 JDL

Zizou wrote:Your assertion only focus is on the elite players at this age. Due to the over emphasis on rankings, league standings, and winning players with soccer abilities are being passed up sometimes just because they cannot handle the physical sometimes dirty play. Another thing to consider is burnout. We are competing for national championship with players as early as 8 years of age. Every game becomes a must win, every game is treated as the most important game you will ever play. I still believe you can get your competitive fix through tournaments. My two cents.

SickofSilliness wrote:Some coaches also take the approach that they can develop players without playing in a "developmental league".

Some coaches didn't buy into the limited substitution rules, which they felt hinders development and limits playing time.

Mall_pugh wrote:Sub rule in JDL :
It's as simple as a speeding violation.

Coaches have used unlimited subs in several games due to thin rosters / injuries or whatever . These coaches are buddies and i don't see them arguing over this silly rule. Don't think the JDL coaches care who wins the games which is admirable.  

SickofSilliness wrote:Some coaches also take the approach that they can develop players without playing in a "developmental league".

Some coaches didn't buy into the limited substitution rules, which they felt hinders development and limits playing time.

ElClassico wrote:From the outside looking in (my DD is older) JDL is just another gimmick to steer girls to the Big 4. It is in no way shape or form designed to develop girls with potential into better players. It's designed to get as many good players in front of certain coaches to allow them to sift through and find the best players at those specific tryouts. Do you actually think these coaches says to themselves, "wow that little #11 has a lot of potential, it may take a few years to develop her but I'll take the chance over the big #15 who just uses her size and speed"...please. Yes the girls in JDL will have a better chance to develop due to the coaches they will play under but don't fool yourself into thinking there is any long term strategy in place. It's simply 4-5 coaches picking the best teams on the playground.

BigErn wrote:

ElClassico wrote:From the outside looking in (my DD is older) JDL is just another gimmick to steer girls to the Big 4. It is in no way shape or form designed to develop girls with potential into better players. It's designed to get as many good players in front of certain coaches to allow them to sift through and find the best players at those specific tryouts. Do you actually think these coaches says to themselves, "wow that little #11 has a lot of potential, it may take a few years to develop her but I'll take the chance over the big #15 who just uses her size and speed"...please. Yes the girls in JDL will have a better chance to develop due to the coaches they will play under but don't fool yourself into thinking there is any long term strategy in place. It's simply 4-5 coaches picking the best teams on the playground.

^ Mostly accurate and 'steering' top talent to the Big 4 is exactly what should be happening, but ...

Among other reasons, JDL was indeed "designed" to improve players, especially for those at U11 and U12 as they have more time.  For example ... simply placing a moderately talented forward on a team with an elite central midfielder will make her better and vice versa.  That and having girls play in different positions/formations will certainly develop better players.

SickofSilliness wrote:

Mall_pugh wrote:Sub rule in JDL :
It's as simple as a speeding violation.

Coaches have used unlimited subs in several games due to thin rosters / injuries or whatever . These coaches are buddies and i don't see them arguing over this silly rule. Don't think the JDL coaches care who wins the games which is admirable.  

SickofSilliness wrote:Some coaches also take the approach that they can develop players without playing in a "developmental league".

Some coaches didn't buy into the limited substitution rules, which they felt hinders development and limits playing time.

and in other games, have been prohibited from doing so, even though the coaches agreed, as the refs were instructed to "follow the rules" - which limit substitutions

KeeperCommander wrote:

SickofSilliness wrote:

Mall_pugh wrote:Sub rule in JDL :
It's as simple as a speeding violation.

Coaches have used unlimited subs in several games due to thin rosters / injuries or whatever . These coaches are buddies and i don't see them arguing over this silly rule. Don't think the JDL coaches care who wins the games which is admirable.  

SickofSilliness wrote:Some coaches also take the approach that they can develop players without playing in a "developmental league".

Some coaches didn't buy into the limited substitution rules, which they felt hinders development and limits playing time.

and in other games, have been prohibited from doing so, even though the coaches agreed, as the refs were instructed to "follow the rules" - which limit substitutions

I did not think the subs were limited so much as they were restricted as to when they could re-enter the game.  (i.e. Once taken out player could not go back in till second half)  Which was one of the ways the non elite would be guaranteed playing time.  Just thoughts.

BigErn wrote:SoS --

I understand that from where you stand that it may appear that way, but knowing these guys and watching these teams, I can assure you that is not the case.  If you talk with LW, CP, JD or GA, they'd tell you they'd like to have 5 girls from one of the others teams than 5 that they have on roster currently.  To form a team completely made up of elite players, you'd have to take the best of the top 4 teams plus grab a few others than remain in outlying Clubs (at least for now).

SickofSilliness wrote:

KeeperCommander wrote:

SickofSilliness wrote:

Mall_pugh wrote:Sub rule in JDL :
It's as simple as a speeding violation.

Coaches have used unlimited subs in several games due to thin rosters / injuries or whatever . These coaches are buddies and i don't see them arguing over this silly rule. Don't think the JDL coaches care who wins the games which is admirable.  

SickofSilliness wrote:Some coaches also take the approach that they can develop players without playing in a "developmental league".

Some coaches didn't buy into the limited substitution rules, which they felt hinders development and limits playing time.

and in other games, have been prohibited from doing so, even though the coaches agreed, as the refs were instructed to "follow the rules" - which limit substitutions

I did not think the subs were limited so much as they were restricted as to when they could re-enter the game.  (i.e. Once taken out player could not go back in till second half)  Which was one of the ways the non elite would be guaranteed playing time.  Just thoughts.

It doesn't guarantee anything

Playing time is determined by the coach - whether you restrict re-entry or not

Sub them in after 15 minutes to rotate kids around, or wait until the final 5 in the half

I've seen numerous coaches (including those above) wait until deep into the first half to make substitutions.  Kids riding the for the first 25+ minutes aren't seeing more playing time than they would otherwise

KeeperCommander wrote:

SickofSilliness wrote:

KeeperCommander wrote:

SickofSilliness wrote:

Mall_pugh wrote:Sub rule in JDL :
It's as simple as a speeding violation.

Coaches have used unlimited subs in several games due to thin rosters / injuries or whatever . These coaches are buddies and i don't see them arguing over this silly rule. Don't think the JDL coaches care who wins the games which is admirable.  

SickofSilliness wrote:Some coaches also take the approach that they can develop players without playing in a "developmental league".

Some coaches didn't buy into the limited substitution rules, which they felt hinders development and limits playing time.

and in other games, have been prohibited from doing so, even though the coaches agreed, as the refs were instructed to "follow the rules" - which limit substitutions

I did not think the subs were limited so much as they were restricted as to when they could re-enter the game.  (i.e. Once taken out player could not go back in till second half)  Which was one of the ways the non elite would be guaranteed playing time.  Just thoughts.

It doesn't guarantee anything

Playing time is determined by the coach - whether you restrict re-entry or not

Sub them in after 15 minutes to rotate kids around, or wait until the final 5 in the half

I've seen numerous coaches (including those above) wait until deep into the first half to make substitutions.  Kids riding the for the first 25+ minutes aren't seeing more playing time than they would otherwise

True
However if you have a roster that is thin and you are not able to put a player back in till second half then you would most definitely second think subs or have a deeper bench.  Deeper bench means you need to sub more to get every player minutes.  Do not know of many coaches that do that.  Thinner benches are prob what caused the coaches to implement their own rule.  I said it early on in this thread, this rule does not advocate for development.  First if you take a player out and you want to give him some instruction on what they might have done wrong or even very right you can not do it.  Not without the risk of not being able to put them right back in afterward.  Silly rule even though it is implemented in ECNL, at this age it does not make much sense.

ForReal wrote:

KeeperCommander wrote:

SickofSilliness wrote:

KeeperCommander wrote:

SickofSilliness wrote:

Mall_pugh wrote:Sub rule in JDL :
It's as simple as a speeding violation.

Coaches have used unlimited subs in several games due to thin rosters / injuries or whatever . These coaches are buddies and i don't see them arguing over this silly rule. Don't think the JDL coaches care who wins the games which is admirable.  

and in other games, have been prohibited from doing so, even though the coaches agreed, as the refs were instructed to "follow the rules" - which limit substitutions

I did not think the subs were limited so much as they were restricted as to when they could re-enter the game.  (i.e. Once taken out player could not go back in till second half)  Which was one of the ways the non elite would be guaranteed playing time.  Just thoughts.

It doesn't guarantee anything

Playing time is determined by the coach - whether you restrict re-entry or not

Sub them in after 15 minutes to rotate kids around, or wait until the final 5 in the half

I've seen numerous coaches (including those above) wait until deep into the first half to make substitutions.  Kids riding the for the first 25+ minutes aren't seeing more playing time than they would otherwise

True
However if you have a roster that is thin and you are not able to put a player back in till second half then you would most definitely second think subs or have a deeper bench.  Deeper bench means you need to sub more to get every player minutes.  Do not know of many coaches that do that.  Thinner benches are prob what caused the coaches to implement their own rule.  I said it early on in this thread, this rule does not advocate for development.  First if you take a player out and you want to give him some instruction on what they might have done wrong or even very right you can not do it.  Not without the risk of not being able to put them right back in afterward.  Silly rule even though it is implemented in ECNL, at this age it does not make much sense.

KC and I agree on something.  The substitution rule, as far as I know, wasn't implemented at the request of the coaches.  If anything, most of them don't like it and, from time to time, have agreed to a free substitution rule with no restrictions on reentry.

ForReal wrote:This was such a good thread.  Now that LH is over and JDL is all but over, I thought it would be fun to revisit this discussion.  And to memorialize this crazy year as so many will be going their separate ways. Here's how I would rank the top 10 teams in NTX.

1.  DTS
2.  Solar Colvin
3.  FCD Red
4.  Kicks
5.  Liverpool
6.  Solar Pulp
7.  Sting Parsons
8.  FCD Blue
9.  Sting Higginbotham
10.  Fever

1 is clear.  2-4 are interchangeable on any given day.  Liverpool is tough to slot as, of the JDL teams, they have only played Sting Higgonbotham other than DTS.

Not intended to slight anyone's DD.  How would you rank them?

physical2005 wrote:Didn't Blue beat Pulp recently- or was that a nightmare?

ColtMcVince wrote:Kicks is on a different level than FCD red and solars.  I would move those down one notch and include LP.  Beyond that, I think the LH teams that are 4-6 or 7 slot in with the likes of Hig and Parsons and maybe throw FCD blue in there.  

Lots of teams in the international tournament this weekend.  Will be interesting to see how things play out.

ForReal wrote:

physical2005 wrote:Didn't Blue beat Pulp recently- or was that a nightmare?

You are correct.  However, given Blue's earlier loss to Pulp (0-3 I believe), I wasn't quite ready to drop them any further.  I did drop Higginbotham as they just lost to Parsons, but their previous contest was a draw.

soccerphun wrote:OK, 05's....let me kick some sleeping dogs and wake this Forum up.  

Pre-season pecking order:

1. DTS Adames -- they could play in the 04 JDL and be very competitive.  One word:  physical  
2. Solar Pulp -- few remnants of last year's State Cup championship team but a very solid reload.
3. Solar Colvin -- this team has been playing together the longest and it shows.
4. Sting Higganbotham -- expect this team to be top dawg or close in 2 years.  
5. FCD Red Baker -- can play with anyone when they play their game, but wheels can come off quickly too.
6. DTC Bussey -- lots of raw athletes that can score in a hurry but gets exposed with lack of technical ability.
7. FCD Blue Baker -- look for a fluid roster here.  Surprisingly light on talent.
8. Sting Parsons -- they will have flashes of brilliance but just don't have the horses to compete for 60 mins.

No excel solver macros...just a compilation of observations since June when the teams started forming.  

Shame we won't see JM's Kicks group in here -- they would have easily been top 5 -- other D'Feeters team would have been slugging it out with Parsons for the cellar.